Air Lift Turbine Generator

[Tom Booth]

This is a very long video, over an hour.

https://youtu.be/7-5qd7bEiqA

The Sterling Allan site, is apparently no more, but he wrote up a "validation" which can still be found on the Way back archive.

https://web.archive.org/web/20160118114 ... /Rosch-KPP

Also, lots of additional information at the archived site I have yet to go through.

https://web.archive.org/web/20160116114 ... Rosch/KPP/


This capture seems more complete

https://web.archive.org/web/20160326063 ... Rosch/KPP/

Some photos didn't load

[Tom Booth]

My suspicions:

One thing that bothers me is the absence of an extended observation of more than a few hours.

I know from my own experience that if I charge my shop compressor tank up to a full 150 psi air tools only require about 90, so I can fill the tank and shut the compressor off and set the pressure regulator at 90 psi and use air tools pretty much all day long until the pressure falls below 90 psi in the tank.

Now to start the big KPP system they fill the tank from a hose going to "the main".

You need only 0.443 psi for every foot down in the water to overcome the water pressure, so if a tower is, say 35 feet tall you only need about 15 psi to inject air that deep down.

So my question is, how long can this thing run on a tank pressurized to maximum, maybe 200psi from the main?

You then get the thing going and it will run the compressor. The compressor keeps the thing going and it could loop that way for a very long time before the pressure drops from 150 to 200 psi down to maybe 20 or 30 before they need to shut it down and refill the tank from the main and start it up again.

So, after a few hours there is this note:

Misc. Notes:

~ 3:45 pm, when I plugged in a grounded extension cord, with nothing plugged into it, using an 2-pronged adaptor, something tripped and the system shut down. (Later, when I told Mr. Dohmen about this, he guessed that the one-prong-only ground connection {usually 2 in Germany} was seen as an anomaly by the circuitry triggering it to shut off. The circuitry is designed to shut off in case someone tries to figure out what is in the circuitry via an outlet.)

OK, so maybe that was just a coincidence.

With the small transparent unit they had to keep shutting it down periodically to prevent it from "overheating".

Or maybe there is a paintball tank under the hood of that little compressor or somewhere. A carbon fiber paintball tank can hold 3000 psi and is relatively small and I could charge one up with my little high pressure Yong Heng.

So a tank about 10 feet high would require just 5 psi pressure to operate.

Now, I'm not making any claims, just saying, if someone really wanted to pull a fast one it's not entirely inconceivable, and I haven't even gotten into, suppose the "main" is pumping out liquid air?

I think that would be obvious. The air tank and hoses would frost up,

But, the thing was also apparently cranking out 18 kw continuously for several hours at least:

the system was producing 18 kW continuously, powering several lights and heaters.

My theory would assume the boyancy motor could run the compressor could run the boyancy motor almost indefinitely NO LOAD.

I doubt any kind of air driven generator or air motor could operate that big of a power draw (18 Kw) from a relatively small tank of air for more than a few minutes regardless of the starting pressure.

But I see no good reason really for filling the tank from "the main" when you should be able to just run the compressor in the room. The start up would just take a little longer maybe... Right?

Having to shut down the small unit every so often to prevent "overheating" seems a bit odd also. A high pressure little compressor like my Yong Heng can run for a short while without water cooling, but all compressors get very hot. But really? They have a giant tank of water that could be used to keep things cool.

The other thing is, well, as indicated previously, the filing status of Ki-Tech is, and apparently has been for years "dormant" in the UK.

Another concern is that "GAIA" had apparently been offering small units to run homes.

Great idea, IMO, but the units, apparently never materialized (?) and money, at least, was refunded, but, now Rosch will only sell utility or very large scale type systems...

I don't know, it's really all rather surreal.

So far my inquiries (forms filled out on the website) to Ki-Tech have gone unanswered.

But it's only been a day or so.

[Fool]

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So my question is, how long can this thing run on a tank pressurized to maximum, maybe 200psi from the main?

You have discovered why it is nothing more than an energy storage device. Efficiency?

Output shaft rpm 7.5 at the top.
18,000 watts

Torque = 16903.7 ft-lbs about. Ever wonder how big the output shaft would need to be?

Tension in chain if 24" diameter 16903.7 pounds about.

If 48" diameter 8451 pounds about.

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[Tom Booth]

I'm not sure what you're getting at above with that calculation or where you're getting the numbers or what you're implying about "shaft length" exactly??? etc



Anyway, I was curious what has become of Sterling Allen?

His website?

Tons and tons of information on alternative energy, going away. But a relatively young guy. Still around? Died?

Anyway, I'd like to ask him about this KPP thing so I tried to find any contact info.

Came across this bio

https://www.iindcoming.org/about

The contact page reads:

You can write a letter to Sterling D. Allan at

Utah State Correctional Facility

Sterling D. Allan 228033 BY-3 114B

P O Box 165300

Salt Lake City, Utah 84116-5000

https://www.iindcoming.org/general-5-5


I haven't been able to find any news articles or additional information about why he is apparently in Utah State Correctional Facility.

[Fool]

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Output shaft diameter to withstand that torque. 7.5 rpm from observing the video. 18000 watts from your earlier post, claimed power out.

Torque from the equations of torque = power/rpms.

Science is mathematics.

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[Tom Booth]

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So my question is, how long can this thing run on a tank pressurized to maximum, maybe 200psi from the main?

You have discovered why it is nothing more than an energy storage device.....

Quite obviously any air tank is "an energy storage device", but being personally very familiar with shop compressors, using air tools as an engine mechanic, as well as in construction, IMO no shop size air tank as seen in the demonstration videos could store enough power for continuous 18 kw output for hours and hours running multiple flood lights and heaters. That "explanation' is merely unfounded speculation, like the supposed imaginary power cable through the imaginary hole in the concrete wall, an easy wave of the hand dismissal.

Nevertheless, compressed air energy storage could be a kind of "battery", and I don't think that possibility was ever suspected or conclusively ruled out in any of the investigations I've seen.

It's about as implausible as the wireless power transmission "explanation". Theoretically, it can be imagined, but realistically, a virtual impossibility for which there is no actual concrete evidence.

Regardless, I think it is something that should be ruled out.

Like the Stirling engine with the compressed air stored in the frame. Compressed air could be stored in the walls of a double walled water tank, in table legs or as some form of liquified gas. But being able to imagine such a thing is a long way from proof.

Ultimately, I tend towards skepticism myself until I build my own device and do my own experiments. Then I need to also rule out wishful thinking and self-hypnosis or self deception. So I make videos of my experiments and post them on science forums.

But now I'm being subject to the exact same kind of "science" based skepticism, which is good to a degree, but your kind of rabbit attack on my character, my integrity or ability to conduct a simple experiment, censorship and blanket dismissals is not something I ever anticipated.

I know I'm not perpetrating any scam, not being dishonest or lying as you constantly accuse me of being. I'm not fudging any experimental results. At least not consciously. I have no reason to. I have no ideology to defend, I just want truth and fact.

You in the other hand are desperate, or seem desperate to uphold obsolete, 1820's "classical" theories. That is not a criticism, particularly, just a factual observation IMO.

You have preconceived opinions to uphold and are not being objective about my experiments or this KPP business.

[Tom Booth]

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Output shaft diameter to withstand that torque. 7.5 rpm from observing the video. 18000 watts from your earlier post, claimed power out.

Torque from the equations of torque = power/rpms.

Science is mathematics.

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Your math or reasoning is flawed IMO on the simple basis that the machine can be observed operating and the shaft(s) are not sheared or twisted off or broken from the torque.

Further, I can currently buy 20 or 30 KW internal combustion generators on the market with engine shafts of lesser diameter than those seen in the KPP demonstration videos.

Why should a buoyancy motor need a larger shaft than a Generac?

generac.jpg (161.81 KiB) Viewed 2583 times

That's a 24kw model

https://www.electricgeneratorsdirect.co ... 09053.html

[Tom Booth]

I think you're also contradicting yourself by saying it's just an energy storage system, then saying the shaft is not strong enough.

What does it matter if the compressed air is "stored" or not, the machine is putting out a measured 18 KW either way and would still require a shaft string enough for the rated load regardless if the tank is filled at the main or by the compressor in the room.

Your "science" is just a snow job.

[Tom Booth]

This video was uploaded just a year ago, it seems anyway. Apparently by someone who appears to be sneaking into the facility.

https://youtu.be/IdcQsF0xgnU

[Fool]

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It has to do with RPM. Faster RPM lower torque. I thought you were a small engine mechanic?

Here are some calculators so you can play with the numbers yourself. Wasn't my observation. Saw it on another site debunking the PPK.

https://www.pmsgen.com/torque.php

https://inventory.powerzone.com/resourc ... %3Apu%3DHP

https://wentechnology.com/resources/cal ... er-torque/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engine_power

The Wikipedia page probably won't help any.

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[Tom Booth]

Translation:

Korean delegation visits Pattaya Power Plant in Thailand

https://youtu.be/NSNdQyrvAXQ

This, from the same channel, appears to be a utility type installation, just sitting there churning away.

Translation: "Buoyancy tube in action"

https://youtu.be/1sU09CP7kpQ

This is interesting, looks like a huge below ground DIY version made from plastic 55 gallon drums.

DIY-KPP.jpg (177.34 KiB) Viewed 2520 times

https://youtu.be/_2kCBGlrbUM

[Tom Booth]

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...Wasn't my observation. Saw it on another site debunking the PPK.
...

What debunking site was that? You put it forward as your own infallible "science".

Now you're distancing yourself from your own claim?

Yes, I've been an engine mechanic my whole life and in my professional opinion as a mechanic you're torque theory is complete horse shit.

[Tom Booth]

I'm finding more and more videos of these utility scale installations just sitting there running. Doing the job. No fan fair, no hype.

https://youtube.com/shorts/_N2OD2SyAMM? ... lCElWG-J3a

[Fool]

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https://gaia.ws1.eu/mmr.php

An attentive reader wondered why the upper drive chain did not immediately shred in the video from ROSCH showing the prototype in operation in Belgrade.

If one assumes that the generator delivers an output of 12 kW as specified by ROSCH, then this power must also be transmitted to the drive shaft.

The above is the blurb that inspired me to use the above numbers.

The rpms can easily be estimated by any of the videos showing the buckets moving over the top.

You put it forward as your own infallible "science".

When you say ignorant libelous slander such as that it just makes me feel sorry for you. There is no way that I can take credit for the equation for the relationship between torque, rpm, and power. Put your own numbers into it.

Learn something. Learn some science and mathematics (not limited to just arithmetic) for once. If you can't, then, look up Internet calculators for this. Ask a highschool mathematics teacher. This stuff is easy once you get past your propensity for denial. Denial appears to be your biggest learning disability. Or maybe it is just intentional deceit? Take a good look at yourself in the mirror and very clearly and slowly ask yourself, "where does the equation for torque, rpm and power come from?" If you see yourself still not comprehending, start the searching for answers, education and learning. Otherwise you will continue to be suspectable to scams like these, and ignorant of science.

You are still spending significant time searching for fraudulent testimony to prove someone elses contraption viable, when it clearly goes against the laws of nature. Don't you think by now that is their problem. If it worked they would be more successful at promoting it. Free energy is free. They could make lots of money just selling the energy, without disclosing how they do it. But no, they need money to sell people plans and blueprints. Bah. Scams.

Read through the following website before you comeback spewing more of your horrible quackery.

https://gaia.ws1.eu/

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[Fool]

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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulser_pump

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