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Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2024 10:07 pm
by Tom Booth
Tom Booth wrote: Tue Sep 10, 2024 6:35 pm Probably it could operate an air-lift spiral pump.


fig19.jpg

https://lurkertech.com/water/pump/tailer/#xtocid213215
This video is well worth watching to the end:
vortex-powered_air-lift_pump.jpg
vortex-powered_air-lift_pump.jpg (65.33 KiB) Viewed 703 times
https://youtu.be/xLaLpMeOyHk

Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 4:40 am
by Fool
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I've seen that YouTube. The graphic artist missed the drain coming out of the lower receptacle or at least lower than the funnel. Read the comments. Many of the commenters don't understand that principal.

The pulser pump is the same kind. Just without the whirlpool input.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulser_pump

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Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2024 9:56 am
by Tom Booth
There is this "artists interpretation":
Air-lift_reverse-siphon.jpg
Air-lift_reverse-siphon.jpg (112.98 KiB) Viewed 664 times

Apparently there is a drain. (F)

However, I'm not convinced it is necessary other than for starting the "reverse siphon".

A steam ejector still seems impossible to me, but it works.

Logically a gravity drain would be needed until the buoyancy of the air-lift pumping action takes over.

Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 7:57 am
by Fool
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The steam injector:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Injector

Works on the principal of the steam/heat engine. Heat going in produces enough power to pump the water in. It does so by expanding something by heat input, with rejection of some but less heat to the atmosphere. Same as a steam engine running a mechanical piston injector pump. It robs some, but not all, of the power from the steam engine or boiler.

It would be fun to set up a small pulser pump with PVC pipe, or maybe clear flexible tubing, and make a YouTube video, to see what height the fall, drain, and stack, can max out to. I don't think the vortex is necessary, but cool, nevertheless. The vortex certainly won't hurt, and could easily be done with a large funnel.

In other words, if the input height to drain is one foot, or inch, can the maximum pumped height be more than a foot, or inch, above the input funnel?

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Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 8:52 am
by Fool
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After studying the artist's conception drawing, it appears non, or poorly functional. The drain F must start at the bottom of tank D and be higher than the input to the stack E. The input to the stack E must be such that it extends below the water level, yet as pressure builds becomes uncovered so pressurized air can enter the stack G. The way it is drawn would work if the tube F is bent up so the output is much higher.

That causes an oscillatory action that puts slugs of air and water into the stack G, allowing the pressure to push the water out. If the output of F is lower, as drawn, the water, air , and pressure would just flow out the bottom.

I suppose there could be a precise restriction in pipe F, potentially adding precision, complexity, and adjustment to the more simpler approach.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trompe

It appears as if the first two images in that Wikipedia page have the same flaw. The third, for the Taylor Hydraulic Trompe, is most likely correct. It certainly shows everything better.
Tayler Trompe
Tayler Trompe
Taylor_trompe_sketch.svg.png (99.33 KiB) Viewed 629 times
The height of the riser shaft should dictate how much air pressure can be built up in the blast pipe, or how high the water can be pushed. Maybe. Height may also be related to the slugs of water verses slugs of air in the 'stack' G. Probably.

The blowoff pipe is the pulser pump, but designed to maximize air pressure.

The operating head plus the maximum flow would dictate the horse power available.

Apparently the action of the blowoff pipe can be quite dramatic on larger Trompes.

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Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 9:25 am
by Fool
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulser_pump
The maximum air pressure that can accumulate depends on the height of the water column between the air chamber and the lower reservoir. The deeper the air chamber is positioned, the higher the elevation to which the water can be pumped.


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Re: Sippy Bird Experiments.

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2024 12:36 pm
by Fool
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If a dry drinking bird bottom is heated up by hand temperature and released it will cycle a few times.

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